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EP Armory Raided by BATF - 80% Lowers

So what is the next step, raiding the homes of everyone that bought one?
 
I am not going to pretend to ever say what an alphabet agency is going to do, but if they deem it "illegal", based on past precedent, they will write everyone a letter and will have to destroy or surrender them, etc.

Which in my opinion is the real reason behind wanting the customer list.

In some cases (akins accelerator), people had to turn in the spring that was in the buttstock that "assisted" in bump firing. This was AFTER it was previously atf tech branch approved. But later changed their mind and said it wasn't approved any more and was suddenly a machinegun.

Another example was a few years ago when the gsg sd recall said the barrel extension was too much like a real silencer and thus was in NFA violation and had to be replaced or be in possession of an unregistered silencer.

This was mostly sorted out prior to customers being notified and the company recalled and replaced the fake silencer barrel extension thingys.

So, really, unless someone is notified by atf, would be nothing more than speculation.

Example: GSG recall:

To all retail customers:

On January 2010 American Tactical Imports Inc received official notification from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and explosives that the original barrel shroud (aka: fake suppressor) supplied with your GSG 5 SD model must be replaced. It has been determined that this shroud is regulated under the National Firearms Act. American Tactical will provide a replacement shroud at no charge for each GSG 5 SD model sold or currently in inventory.

Consumers in possession of a GSG 5 SD model with the original shroud in place on the firearm are now in violation of the NFA. To avoid continued violation of the NFA, ATI asks that all persons in possession obtain a replacement shroud as soon as possible. We anticipate arrival of the new shrouds to begin by the middle of February 2010.

IMPORTANT: THE ORIGINAL SD MODEL SHROUD MUST BE RETURNED ACOMPANIED BY THE FIREARM SERIAL NUMBER BEFORE A REPLACEMENT SHROUD IS ISSUED. THE DIAMETER OF THE SD SHROUD IS 1-9/16”. DO NOT RETURN THE SMALLER CARBINE SHROUD.

WHAT TO DO:
If possible return your old shroud to the dealer where purchased and show him this notice. The shroud will be returned to ATI along with a list of serial numbers from the guns that the shrouds were removed. ATI will send replacements to the dealer for pick up at your convenience; ATI will be sending replacements as fast as logistics allow. If your dealer is out of business or difficult to reach, or you purchased your gun used, from a consumer, return the shroud directly by US mail or UPS to American Tactical Imports Inc. 100 Airpark Drive Rochester, NY 14624.

PLEASE TRY NOT TO CALL US. We will provide comprehensive information on our web site www.americantactical.us , and www.ar15.com or by e-mail to atiexchange@americantactical.us

REMEMBER, INCLUDE THE FIREARM SERIAL NUMBER WITH EACH SHROUD OR A REPLACEMENT WILL NOT BE ISSUED.

This action IS NOT being instituted through any fault and is strictly due to NFA compliance. American Tactical will assume the responsibility to satisfy the requirements in an effort to minimize the impact on our customers and protect your investment.

We at American Tactical Imports Inc. sincerely apologize for any inconvenience caused by this unfortunate situation.

Sincerely,
Anthony DiChario
President C.E.O.
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Back in the 90's a friend sent off for one of those WWII submachine gun kits. It came with all the parts to assemble the gun but the receiver was destroyed. The place he bought it from didn't quite destroy it enough and he received notification from the ATF that it must be returned for further destruction. If it wasn't returned they would come and get it. He sent it back. It was later received back with further cuts in the receiver.

I'm guessing that this would be something similar
 
Great so not only did I waste money on a POS piece of polymer, I'm going to have to destroy it with no compensation. Got to love how all this works.


What if the buyer got PO'd at the low quality of the lower, and trashed it with now proof to provide to alphabet agency?
 
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@MikeD again, I am speculating. Nothing has been said to owners, and nothing may. My crystal ball doesn't fast forward.

As for if someone built a lower and it did not work, technically, it would need to be demilled according to batfe guidelines/standards because at the time any machining is done even if it was crap, that is the magic point where it suddenly becomes a firearm, so that's when demilling and such comes into play.

If one were to destroy it.

But if I have to turn something in, it sure as hell isn't going to be in working order. I'm just funny that way.
 
Got this email today from EPArmory

Our Loyal EP Armory Customers,

We have been going through some tough times here at EP Armory lately as the result of an ATF investigation into our polymer precursor receiver product (aka polymer “80% lower”). The investigation has hurt our sales, and we’ve been swamped with emails and phone calls asking about the situation and the legal status of our product. There has been lots of speculation, and rumors are going around. A lot of the information out there is wrong.

We want to set the record straight, but as hard as we have tried, we simply haven’t been able to respond to each inquiry individually. We hope this message, and information that has been published or will soon be published by our attorneys at Michel & Associates, P.C. will help answer some of these questions. You can access the available information about this investigation, related investigations, and a bunch of other helpful information, HERE .

ATF offices throughout the state of California and across the country have also gotten lots of calls from concerned citizens seeking direction relating not only to the legality of the sales of EP Armory’s product, but to “80% lowers” in general. And they aren’t happy with the vague “answers” they’re (not) getting from ATF.

Although EP Armory has been largely silent so far about the actions of ATF regulators in mischaracterizing our polymer precursor lower receiver product as a “firearm,” we have been taking concrete actions to protect both our interests, and the privacy rights of our customers. Our lawyers have been and are working hard on our, and our customers’, behalf. They are in discussions with representatives from the highest levels of the ATF to resolve the outstanding legal issues regarding our polymer precursor receiver product, and to get our property and records returned to us as soon as possible. Through these ongoing discussions with ATF officials, ATF lawyers, and lawyers with the United States Attorney’s Office our lawyers at Michel& Associates, P.C. hope to convince the ATF investigators that these polymer precursor receivers are not “firearms” under the law, should not be regulated as such, that these investigations should be concluded, and the seized records and property returned.

We need your support to win this fight! To help us fund and win this legal battle, we will set up an “EP Armory Legal Defense Fund.” We ask. . . Once we win our fight to resume sales of our EP80 polymer lower non-firearm, we will promptly ship EP80's! You can be among the first to receive a Polymer 80% Receiver once the legal issues are resolved. And we are confident that they will be back! Of course, if you would prefer to support us by purchasing another of our products, we still have the entire remainder of our product line available, including our aluminum 80% lower receivers, which the ATF has not mischaracterized as “firearms” under the law, and which were not seized. You can order our products HERE . We appreciate your support!

From the front lines in the fight for the right to keep and bear arms,

Sincerely,

EP ARMORY
Click to expand...
 
Interesting they basically just inverted the process and formed,bonded the receiver body around the filler material as opposed to filling the preformed receiver.. If this gets them a pass, which it looks like it might based on the current wording of the law, I bet they definitions will be changed later to force them to form it as one piece.
 
Yep - got the letter and (like Mike) I believe each win will be followed by a new/modified form of attack.
 
Ares vs ATF
lets not forget this, been following it most the summer when I was in civilization......support them if you need parts. I vowed a part per build and am getting a BCG for my current build....These boy are deeper behind enemy lines than most anyone

read the timeline.....watch the videos parental advisory....be a parent don't blame me you snotty brat watched the video, thats your bad...the TV isn't the babysitter

http://aresarmor.com/store/Ares-Armor-dispute-with-the-ATF








for you that have really long attention spans and Rickmo

 
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Great videos brother.

First one was pretty funny, but on point. The second one was about 20 minutes too long, but still worth the watch. To paraphrase the second video, Ares Armor CEO Dimitri Karras - "They call these 80% lowers loopholes? Gun laws written to restrict firearms ownership for American citizens are the true loopholes. They are loopholes around the Second Amendment."

Excellent statement. I've got four of their Amentum Slider slings so far and will continue to look to them for my future product needs...
 
I know that this is an old topic, but the wheels of justice spin slow.

Just read where ATF had to return all of the seized goods from Ares. And perhaps not surprisingly, there were a lot of them missing, and apparently taken from the evidence room where they had been logged I assume.
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https://www.guntraband.com/

These items were confiscated by the BATFE goons on the Ides of March in 2014, after I sued the agency, demanding that the items be returned, the BATFE complied with my demand and returned the items to my possession. While returning the items to me, sans any of the required legalese associated with transferring "firearms" in California, the BATFE absurdly continued to insist the the items were "illegally manufactured firearm receivers." The BATFE further failed to return 18 of the items, which magically disappeared out of their evidence room.
 
I hope Karras has filed a lawsuit against F-troop's larceny with Eric Holder as primary respondent.

What makes me think he just might know where the missing arms are?

images
 
I've seen some recent mania in the media about "ghost guns" here that is soon drowned out by saner minds. I'm hoping the POSs that got elected on the Beast's pantsuittails (even though SHE lost) quickly get kicked out in 2yrs. These are the numbnuts still calling for "assault weapons bans" and "universal background checks" and submit bills every year that don't even make it to committee... :rolleyes:
 
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