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Question Of The Month. (February 2017) with poll.

Should Businesses that Ban Guns, Be Liable for Criminal Attacks?

  • Are you high?

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • No Comment

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Sue Everyone!!!!

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    12
  • Poll closed .
Any business has the right to determine what does or does not go on under their roof.

With that said, discrimination of not serving particular skin colors has been shot down in court, apparently gays can sue if cake makers don't want to make them a wedding cake and car companies and campbells soups and burger king can promote political agenda's, they do nothing but alienate a lot of their customer base and would be prudent to stay out of politics altogether. Someone is going to be offended either way. Why would any business really want to lose a customer just to make a personal/political statement is beyond me.
 
... Why would any business really want to lose a customer just to make a personal/political statement is beyond me.
I gotta ask, why would such people patronize a business that has views antithetical to theirs. Do gays, black, Jews, women, or what ever aggrieved group really want to give their money for a silly wedding cake? No, what they want is to make a personal/political statement, get press and tube time, and maybe pick up some punitive moolah from the court.

Damn, I wish I were a judge.

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I gotta ask, why would such people patronize a business that has views antithetical to theirs.

I don't. But there seems to me so many in the last few years, is making it more difficult. And goes back to my point. Why would a company want to do that in the first place?
 
They were all trying to get on the Hillary Clinton leftist Democrat gravy train.

I bet they all felt like idiots when it failed to leave the Station too!
 
Any business has the right to determine what does or does not go on under their roof. . .


Well within reason they do. They can't tell me what color shirt to wear but they can certainly tell me I need to wear shoes.

They can certainly insist that people be quiet and Peaceable. Or loud and Rowdy as the occasion demands.

But I don't think they have the right to tell me what I can carry hidden in my pocket as long as it's not radioactive or biologically hazardous etc.

And I keep it hidden!

If nobody knows there's never any trouble
 
Funny you mention the USPS. None of the ones around here have the "No guns" signs. Not in the building or in the parking lots. I "know" they should be there but I look each time I go inside one and none are in sight. Maybe it's posted on the Employees bulletin board. After all, that IS where "going Postal" started. So, no signs, I carry.

BTW, one additional place I don't carry is schools. We can lock them in the car in the parking lot but inside is a BIG no-no.

Yup, it slipped my mind about schools being "gun free" zones. Regarding USPS, it doesn't matter if they have signage or not it is still a federal crime to carry anywhere on the property. As much as I hate to, I will park in an adjacent parking lot, leave my pistol in the car and dash over to the USPS.
 
The sign on the door of a business prohibiting a firearm is their choice. The choice to do business with them is mine. I carry to protect myself and family, no more, no less. If I see a robbery in progress I will take a safe position and call 911. If I am threatened I will defend myself. I am trying to keep things simple in my old age.
 
We are commanded by God not to murder, but at the same time we have the responsibility to protect our families and ourselves from harm.

I've always felt that if I had to kill to protect my family that I would do it and leave the consequences to God's judgement. He can determine what is murder and what is not.

By the same token, if I had to go somewhere that I didn't feel was safe to go un-armed, I will attend to my own protection first, and to the legal, political or moral concerns of others after.
I agree that's why it's a concealed firearm if I don't need it nobody knows I have it if I need folks will glad it was there let the lawyer sort it out
 
Yep, the conceal part is to my advantage.In Oklahoma a few people open carry, but personally I'd rather conceal. I don't want to make myself an obvious target.
 
The joke here is that if you observed all the "gun-free school zones" in Fresno you couldn't get around town.
You'd wind up on a one-way street with a school: can't go forward, can't go back, can't turn around.

You have to leave your car there and walk back.

But the county south of us decided that a school staff could be armed.

Meanwhile some other Calif cities have literally outlawed gun dealers.

While we have 30 in town here.

The whole business is a joke.
 
I guess the part that I don't understand from the side that says it's ok for businesses to disarm arm us is this: Where in the Constitution does it say that their right out weighs mine? Article 2 of the Bill of Rights states: "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." Y'all know that without me posting it. Most on here will raise hell about their state legislature adding another hurdle to owning or buying a gun. Many of us have stood in the rain, snow, cold and heat to stop that very thing. But then some will say it is ok for a 7-11, McDonalds or some other business to ban us from carrying inside their building. I don't get it. What article or paragraph in the Constitution says a business owner's likes or dislikes overpower my right to bear arms and self defense?

I understand that the government feels it can walk all over us but not so with common citizens. I will exercise my right (and natural Law) to defend myself and my family wherever I may go. Those little BS "no gun" signs are not going to stop me. As long as I do not infringe on other's right to life and happiness there should not even be an argument.
 
Although I voted for liability, I think I should clarify because I am a firm believer in personal responsibility and loathe those who would run to a lawyer instead of trying to work things out. But think in the lines of those who would not be carrying such as a child.

I am also a devout capitalist. If I do not like the policies of a company, I am free to take my business somewhere else. I will not take a company to court to sue over the fact they refuse to acknowledge my man-alligator love and make me a cake to celebrate said union...
 
I guess the part that I don't understand from the side that says it's ok for businesses to disarm arm us is this: Where in the Constitution does it say that their right out weighs mine? Article 2 of the Bill of Rights states: "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." Y'all know that without me posting it. Most on here will raise hell about their state legislature adding another hurdle to owning or buying a gun. Many of us have stood in the rain, snow, cold and heat to stop that very thing. But then some will say it is ok for a 7-11, McDonalds or some other business to ban us from carrying inside their building. I don't get it. What article or paragraph in the Constitution says a business owner's likes or dislikes overpower my right to bear arms and self defense?

I understand that the government feels it can walk all over us but not so with common citizens. I will exercise my right (and natural Law) to defend myself and my family wherever I may go. Those little BS "no gun" signs are not going to stop me. As long as I do not infringe on other's right to life and happiness there should not even be an argument.

The Bill of Rights was created to restrict government, not an individual, or privately owned business. It limits what government can or more specifically in this question, what it CANNOT do.

However, I don't think it pertains to privately owned anything. Whether it is a business or a home, or a church or whatever. It is my firm belief that they can restrict rights while on their property and do so legally.

This is where I fall upon my Constitutionalist leanings.

I don't think that a business should be required to do anything they do not want to do. After all, it is within their "right" to say no guns allowed. In the same breath, I think they should also be allowed the final say into whether they can refuse service to any customer they wish to and without fear of reprisal from anyone.

no gay wedding cakes, no guns allowed, no shoes, no shirt, no service, etc.

You can't really swing both ways on this subject, although there are many that do or want to because they may like it when some businesses that they agree with their policies do. But for any business they don't agree with, they scream foul, discrimination or anything else.

It's sickening to see organizations such as the cub scouts be forced to accept girls. Same for the girl scouts. But that's because they have gotten sick of defending theirselves in court about it, so they were effectively beaten into submission, which again, I feel is so wrong and anti-constitutional.

If a particular person does not like a companies policy, in no way are they forced to support that business, with possibly the exception of health insurance now, which I still think is not constitutional if you do not like everything about it.

But for every other business, you are welcome to spend your money with a company that you do like.

Don't go away mad, just go away. If I as a business owner goes bankrupt and starve, that's all on me. Just the definition of capitalism should be pretty self explaining. But unfortunately, too many are not educated well enough to understand it.

Capitalistic economy:

Capitalism is an economic system based on private ownership of the means of production and their operation for profit. Characteristics central to capitalism include private property, capital accumulation, wage labor, voluntary exchange, a price system, and competitive markets.
 
While I agree with most of what you said, John, my carrying concealed does not deprive a business owner of any right or protection under the law. I am exercising my right to carry and they are exercising their right to run their business. The two are not mutually exclusive. As you stated, businesses should not be forced to provide services for those they chose not to. But, the SCOTUS has ruled that businesses can't discriminate based on a number of factors, that store owners cannot hamper people’s civil and Constitutional rights just because they have private property rights. Each of those factors are based on the individual's rights. Those individual rights outweigh the business's rights. IMO, so it is with carrying a firearm. By simply carrying a concealed firearm, how am I interfering with a business owner's operation of their business? As long as I don't threaten them or their customers (which there are laws governing such actions) I am not interfering in the least. Since they are open to the public (and I am the public) and not a semi-private company with the requisite membership requirements, they can not hamper me from exercising my rights. I did not sign my rights away by walking thru the door. My right is unalienable, one that is not able to taken or given away.

I believe that the banning of firearms is more politically motivated than personal beliefs of the owner, especially in the large corporations such as Starbucks or BWW. There is no local owner and most of the no-gun signs are directed from the board and forced on the franchise owner regardless of their personal views. While Starbucks did not come out and completely ban firearms they are playing the political Ping-Pong match trying to appease both sides of the fence. BWW did ban firearms but, at least here in Ohio, their signs do not meet the requirements directed by law for implementing the ban. Regardless, I stopped going there years ago.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree. But this is a very thought provoking discussion.
 
IMO Any business which has posted such a policy does so out of fear and possibly hate.

Fortune favors the brave.

Ill-fortune will follow the haters and the cowards.
 
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