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Shotguns: non-Mossberg

Discussion in 'Long Guns' started by DaveinCT, Dec 22, 2010.

  1. CaddmannQ

    CaddmannQ 12g Supporter

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    8,395
    Evidently this is bunk. These guns were made in runs for different client contracts, and serial numbers got reused like 3x over the decades. The guns were stamped sequentially within these runs, but were never delivered sequentially. The production date had almost nothing to do with the date of sale, even in a rough sense, over more than very short time periods.

    Good records no longer exist, so close dating is said to be impossible.
  2. CaddmannQ

    CaddmannQ 12g Supporter

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    8,395
    I get a lot of good feedback about the 16 Ga. but what about those X's? Looks to me like some very old and somewhat amatuer repairs to a stock that's been abused heavily.
    The patches weren't pinned or doweled or keyed in place, or at least the missing one wasn't. One remains attached, thus unknown.

    My plan was to buy a new buttstock, and finish it myself, but I might fix this one. I'll know more when I have the time to play with it.

    I suspect the trigger guard screws were stripped and then bigger screws forced in. I might have to make steel inserts and re-drill/tap/etc.

    The butt pad is off a Winchester and doesn't fit. It's abused & it'll probably get tossed.

    From what I can tell mechanically, this gun should fire OK. I bought some shells so might get to try it out Sunday.
    ripjack13 likes this.
  3. John A.

    John A. I'm "THAT" guy Staff Member Global Moderator Moderator

    Messages:
    15,036
    (Guessing) the x's were done to show how many animals it's killed. Kind of like Japanese zero's painted on the engine cowl of old F4 corsair to show how many aircraft have been shot down.

    But back to the subject of 16 gauge, I own a couple. I have used them with very good success, and they are light and handy.
  4. CaddmannQ

    CaddmannQ 12g Supporter

    Messages:
    8,395
    Oh, that's interesting. I was assuming that whomever repaired the stock cut those x's to help hold the glue and to sort of key the patch in place.
  5. CaddmannQ

    CaddmannQ 12g Supporter

    Messages:
    8,395
    I took another good look at that 16 gauge Ranger 5000 last night.

    I also took the butt stock off of it to look at the mechanism.

    While doing some research on the markings I have come to believe that this gun was made about 1939, right about the start of World War 2, but they were few of this exact pattern because of the war.

    It seems there are many many earlier and later variations floating around which differ somewhat in the lock work, the trigger guard & the type of floor plate: if removable or non-removable.

    The later models all seem to have an inscribed model number on the left side, which mine does not have.

    Earlier models seem to have a different lock work which is evident by the pin arrangement on the side of the receiver, the length of the tang, and an earlier style of script in the Ranger name.

    This gun supposedly equates to a Stevens 515 but I haven't seen a diagram which proves that yet.

    A Diagram is reputed to exist and to be marked Stevens 515, but in parentheses it says "receiver Marked 5000", (which mine is.)

    Evidently the Springfield Stevens guns were Marked Stevens 515 on the left side and 5000 on the right side, while trade guns and Guns for Sears and Roebucks were not marked with the number on the left side in my gun's particular production run.

    All this leads me to hope that this one might be more rare than even the Hunter Arms or Fulton built Rangers.
    ripjack13 likes this.
  6. CaddmannQ

    CaddmannQ 12g Supporter

    Messages:
    8,395
    I've been working on this buttstock a bit. This was an oil finish stock that at some point had been varnished. I scraped off of the remaining varnish with a razor blade, and I rubbed the stock down with Howard's butcher block conditioning oil. This is basically carnauba wax & food grade mineral oil. I don't know if this works better or worse than linseed oil, but it's more expensive and I already had some.

    It had one crack in the middle that I glued with Crazy Glue. I had one small crack that was heavily polluted and I had to open it out and fill it with epoxy.

    Two small pieces of Walnut that had been patched onto the stock are both removed, the old glue was scraped off, and the wood cleaned by scraping.

    I Do not think this gunstock can be successfully patched with little pieces of wood. I intend to shape those pieces completely from scratch using epoxy putty.

    After all shaping and sanding is finished, I will paint the epoxy and wood grain it by hand to match.
    ripjack13 likes this.
  7. CaddmannQ

    CaddmannQ 12g Supporter

    Messages:
    8,395
    The epoxy I used didn't work very well. I ended up scraping it all out & using a different brand.

    The Butcher Block oil is working out really nice though. I don't know how well it will hold up in practice but it seems to last on my butcher block.
  8. CaddmannQ

    CaddmannQ 12g Supporter

    Messages:
    8,395
    Well I'm on my third round of bedding and patching and it's looking pretty good. I'll post some photos tonight.
    Now I have to paint the patches to look like wood.

    It was difficult to fix because this one has been patched before and the stock was sanded and slightly reshaped. I ended up doing more re-shaping to the stock to get it to look right. Of course I lost a lot of patina. I'll fake that back in to hide the sanding and scraping I had to do.

    Also I bought a grind-to-fit Limbsaver recoil pad. I'll need to fit that and attach it.
  9. CaddmannQ

    CaddmannQ 12g Supporter

    Messages:
    8,395
    The lugs that lock the stock into the receiver were worn and weakened. I scraped them off well and coated with Woodweld.
    20160523_000120.jpg

    I shaved them with a jewelers file, to fit tight in the receiver, which took some patience. Hell the whole business took a lot of patience and it's not quite done.

    I've got the limbsaver somewhat shaped and attached, but it's going to need some more sanding to look right.

    1464074921516878491187.jpg

    I screwed it on the stock, scribed it, and then rough shaped it with the Dremel Moto tool in a wood vise.

    I continued shaping it with a flat file and sanding screen. It fits the stock now, and I jist have to blend it on a bit.
    ripjack13 likes this.
  10. CaddmannQ

    CaddmannQ 12g Supporter

    Messages:
    8,395
    I kind of turned this into my "how to" thread.
    It wasn't really my intention but I didn't know how much work this gun was going to end up being.
    . . .I mean I didn't know how much fun this gun was going to end up being to work on. :cool:

    Anyhow I shot it for the first time today. I shot High brass low brass and medium brass. High brass Remington gave me one dud. Low brass fiocchi and medium brass Winchester shot flawlessly.

    I put 12 rounds through it, and the gun felt absolutely solid. I am so pleased at how this turned out. :)

    With the new limbsaver attached, I was even able to persuade my little wife to shoot one off. She put an ounce of number 8 birdshot through a Target at 30 yards quite handily.

    She could easily take out half the geese at our local pond..
    ripjack13 likes this.
  11. CaddmannQ

    CaddmannQ 12g Supporter

    Messages:
    8,395
    The black Remingtons were the high brass shells and one had a dud primer. I struck it 6 times and no dice.
    20160529_191721.jpg
    Cut it open, burned thd powder, saved the shot and cup. And pressed out the bad primer.

    It looked OK to me.
    ripjack13 likes this.
  12. ripjack13

    ripjack13 Resident Sawdust Maker Staff Member Administrator Supporter "Philanthropist"

    Messages:
    22,402
    @CaddmannQ , I'm going to copy your posts about this and make a new topic in the
    Firearm Maintenance, Modification, Safety area. Just in case in the future someone looks for that particular model, we can draw attention to it and attract possible new members. If you have more picture of the process add em in.
  13. CaddmannQ

    CaddmannQ 12g Supporter

    Messages:
    8,395
    I was going to ask somebody to do that for me. Thank you Rip.

    I'm going to consolidate all of my photographs etc. there, later.
    ripjack13 likes this.
  14. CaddmannQ

    CaddmannQ 12g Supporter

    Messages:
    8,395
    Hey thanks again to RipJack for moving all my posts and pictures.

    Does anyone know of a really good forum for old shotguns, like my Ranger from the thirties?

    I dont think parts are available anywhere for this one. I might have to fix a firing pin. The left one appears to be short, and it will FTF one in 10 shells.
  15. Scoop

    Scoop .30-06

    Messages:
    2,078
    Did you ever try http://www.shotgunworld.com/ ?
    LTB45 likes this.
  16. Rossignol

    Rossignol The Original Sheriff Staff Member Global Moderator Moderator Sponsor

    Messages:
    12,758
    I fired an H&R break action yesterday, single shot 12 ga fixed modified choke and I think 24" barrel.

    We fired several different loads from bird shot to 00, Hornady Critical Defense and Winchester low recoil Ranger.

    For the heck of it, we also fired a 3" Winchester turkey magnum. Never again.
    LAZY EYED SNIPER likes this.
  17. CaddmannQ

    CaddmannQ 12g Supporter

    Messages:
    8,395
    Hey thanks Scoop. I did some research there, and I even joined the forums.

    From what I read, my 16 ga is rare and worth a lot more than the 12 ga, and my type 5000 receiver model is worth more than the later & more common 5100s as well.

    But is the Ranger version worth more or less than the Stevens version?

    Unknown so far.

    BTW, since this one has been bobbed off on both ends, I assumed its collector value is really about nil. Not 100% sure if that is so yet
  18. Elbert Garrett

    Elbert Garrett .30-06 Supporter

    Messages:
    1,208
    [​IMG]

    This is my little cut down Sears 20 by Savage, $100 in a local pawn shop. I cut down to 18 3/4" to allow for mistakes and to make sure it remain legal. It took a little work with a hack saw and then I used some course, medium and fine emery cloth to even and smooth the cut and then a blue stick to protect the cut from the elements. It`s turned out to be one of my favorites.....00 buckshot is hard to find around here but I can get #3, #4 and slugs in town. [​IMG] I can hit a pie with a slug @ `50 and she holds a nice pattern with buckshot in the `14 to `21 range.....

    Brownells sells bead kits (bead, bit and tap) around $10 to $12 but I haven`t got around to doing that yet.
    CaddmannQ and Rossignol like this.
  19. CaddmannQ

    CaddmannQ 12g Supporter

    Messages:
    8,395
    That's a nice little shotgun. Can you tell the age?

    .
    Elbert Garrett likes this.
  20. Elbert Garrett

    Elbert Garrett .30-06 Supporter

    Messages:
    1,208
    No Sir, not an exact date but from what I`ve seen probably mfg in the late 60`s or early 70`s.

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