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Total Newbie - Overwhelmed by choices (500 vs 590 vs 590A1 & more)

S

Spanky

.410
Hello all, I've been browsing this forum and others for a while, trying to figure out which direction to go for my first purchase. I'm not totally new to guns, I've used a couple Mossberg 500's and just love how they work. I am however new to buying a new gun and I want to make the right investment for my needs. I'll try to organize this post but chances are good I'll start rambling a few times. Basically, I'm looking for advice for my needs and opinions about my line of thinking.


Needs/Considerations:
I live in a semi-rural area, just outside a small town. As such, I'm not concerned too much about home defense. I mean, it's a thought in the back of my mind, just not a primary concern. So, I don't need a super-tactical shotgun with shortest possible barrel. What do I need? Primary concerns are pest/vermin control and woods self defense. I've used a youth model 500 with either a 22" or 24" barrel and unknown choke to take down a pesky rabbit at 45 yards. I'd like to continue to do that. I'd also like to have something that I can sling over my shoulder and carry in the woods for bigger predators. I hear of wolves and cougars attacking people and running into a smaller bear is certainly possible. I'd like to be confident in loading up some magnum buckshot and slugs to remedy any of those situations in the woods.

Sure, I could carry a .357 magnum or similar for a woods carry and use a .410 choked up for smaller pests. But that brings me to the 'why' part below.

Also in the back of my mind with home defense is the ability to hunt in a SHTF situation. There's plenty of pheasants, geese, quail, rabbits and whatnot running around. I could even load up a slug and get a deer at 100 yards. I could put food on the table with a shotgun. I probably won't, but I could.


Why a 12 gauge?
Pistols are fine but having shot a few, I'm not a horrible shot but it leaves me wanting a bit more accuracy. Also, I just don't like holsters. Carrying around a pistol can be awkward. I prefer something I can sling over my shoulder, even if it weighs 5x as much. My choice for 12 gauge stems from the fact that this will be, somewhat, a defensive weapon and in those situations, you want oomph. I've also researched both local stores and online catalogs and there's just more variety out there for 12 gauge. Defensive rounds, light loads, flight control wads... more to choose from.


Why a pump?
Reliability and cost. I'm sure the 935 and SA-20 are called reliable but there's more cleaning required and while I'm not going to slack on that, those platforms can be more sensitive to contamination and some rounds. I would love to have a 935 and have lesser recoil but that's not enough reason to overcome higher maintenance and cost in my book. Especially when there's very nice and affordable recoil pads. Plus, there seems like there's more accessories for the 5xx line.


Where am I at now?
My current thought process has me heavily eyeballing the 590, specifically the 50663. I like ghost sights, used them before on an AR15 and loved the function and accuracy. They don't stick out much and aren't as fragile as a scope/optic but provide more accuracy than a bead. But, I'm not 100% set on that model. For not much more, I can get the 590A1. The thicker barrel doesn't sell me, nor does the metal safety (I'll probably replace it anyway). The two things I do like are the parkerized finish and metal trigger group. The $40 more for the A1 version seems worth it for a more durable coating. I'm even looking at the 51668, the 590A1 with speedfeed stock but I'm not sure it's worthwhile, there's reports of it not holding rounds properly. Did Mossberg fix these issues?

I also like the 590 for the ammo capacity. But a big hang-up I have is cylinder bore. I'd like to have an improved cylinder to reach out a bit further to get pests/vermin. It's my understanding that a cylinder bore won't do humane kills with birdshot at 50 yards. However, I need to have the right balance for choke since I'd still like to load up slugs for woods carry. I'd like to just keep 1 choke in the gun at all times, not have to think about it. I've thought about having a local gunsmith ream and tap the 20" cylinder bore barrel for a choke but I don't know if I'm overthinking this or not.

I've thought of the 500 but I can't seem to find the right loadout for me. I feel like the 590 is a better investment for durability and longevity.

I'll be stopping in the local gun store tomorrow and see about getting a feel for the models they have, how they pull up and feel.




Bottom line, I want to get this right. I don't often have significant funds laying around and this is something that's been on my wishlist. The only other gun I have is a Marlin 60 .22 rifle. This shotgun will be my first new purchase and I want to make the right choices.
So, if you've read this and have some advice, thank you. Hopefully this can brew up some discussion.
 
I'd suggest you consider the Marinecoat finish, since you mentioned being out in the woods. More durable than other finishes when it comes to corrosion protection. It's available on some models of both the 500 and 590.
 
If you are not concerned with magazine capacity and do intend to use it primarily for hunting with HD as a secondary option I would go with a 500. I would actually go with a turkey model (purely my personal preference). It has a medium length barrel which will work well for hunting as while being short enough to function well as a HD gun in close quarters. it also allows the use of interchangeable choke tubes which will allow it to be more versatile in the woods for small game.

That said, if you are handy you can swap a few parts and make your own custom model. The most notable differences between the 500 and the 590 is the magazine tube and barrel lug. The receivers will accept either barrel. I own a 835 which has the same barrel lug as the 590 yet I was able to swap out the magazine tube to one from a 500 and then use a 500 barrel on my 835 receiver.

Many configurations are available to you in this way so no matter what you choose you are not completely locked in to that models's accessories. The stocks and forents, etc are all interchangeable as well. Some require an adapter based on configuration but for the most part accessories within a specific gauge are pretty much interchangeable. Heck you can even get a short 590/500 security barrel drilled and tapped for choke tubes if that's the route you want to take. it all comes down to how much time/money you want to invest vs. buying something right out of the box.
 
Looks to me like you need an 835.

Threaded for chokes, chambered for up to 3.5" magnum loads, and compatible with just about any accessory made for the 500 or 590. They're over bored to 10 gauge diameter so not recommended for use with slugs, but can be swapped out for a rifled 835 barrel for sabots or a smooth bore 590a1 barrel for rifled slugs. The 835 comes in barrel lengths from 20"*28" and most are camo finished, but there are a few models that are blued or park'd. Don't think there anre any 835 models with ghost rings, but there are models with 3-dot rifle sights.

Seems the 835 might suit your needs without any modification...
 
The biggest differences in the 590 and the 500 is as follows.

The 590 has a little thicker barrel
The 590 doesn't have any plastic parts in the trigger assembly.

Those are the main ones that I always come back to, although there are a few more.

There is really nothing wrong with the 590, the 500, and I'm even going to throw in another you hadn't mentioned. The Maverick 88. It is nearly the same as the 500 but a little less expensive. And you can get them with the higher capacity magazine you want right off the shelf.

example:
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=488557090#PIC

Though keep in mind that you can load a pump shotgun on the go so magazine capacity isn't a major concern for most.

A shotgun is a very capable tool and able to take down anything that walks on the North American continent with the correct selection of shell(s).

Just one bit of advice, while a 357 will kill a bear, it's not likely to stop a charging bear.
 
Wow, thanks for all the replies and thoughts guys. Nice to see active staff members on a forum.

GunnyGene said:
I'd suggest you consider the Marinecoat finish, since you mentioned being out in the woods. More durable than other finishes when it comes to corrosion protection. It's available on some models of both the 500 and 590.
Click to expand...
I was actually able to check out a 500 with MarineCoat at the store today. There was a big scratch in it but it didn't go through. It seems pretty durable and a nice finish. I'm not hot on the color but that doesn't bug me much. I see there's a MAGPUL version of the 500 that is parkerized and already includes the forward grip I wanted. I don't intend to abuse the gun or walk through thick brush a lot so maybe I don't need something as tough as MarineCote.

MikeD said:
If you are not concerned with magazine capacity and do intend to use it primarily for hunting with HD as a secondary option I would go with a 500. I would actually go with a turkey model (purely my personal preference). It has a medium length barrel which will work well for hunting as while being short enough to function well as a HD gun in close quarters. it also allows the use of interchangeable choke tubes which will allow it to be more versatile in the woods for small game.

That said, if you are handy you can swap a few parts and make your own custom model. The most notable differences between the 500 and the 590 is the magazine tube and barrel lug. The receivers will accept either barrel. I own a 835 which has the same barrel lug as the 590 yet I was able to swap out the magazine tube to one from a 500 and then use a 500 barrel on my 835 receiver.

Many configurations are available to you in this way so no matter what you choose you are not completely locked in to that models's accessories. The stocks and forents, etc are all interchangeable as well. Some require an adapter based on configuration but for the most part accessories within a specific gauge are pretty much interchangeable. Heck you can even get a short 590/500 security barrel drilled and tapped for choke tubes if that's the route you want to take. it all comes down to how much time/money you want to invest vs. buying something right out of the box.
Click to expand...
After your post and seeing some variations at the gun store the other day, I was backtracking and thinking of going with a 500 6-shot so I could have a vast selection of barrels to drop-in if I wanted. Then, a problem came to mind; I would lose my front sight or be limited to barrels with front sights already installed OR hire a local gunsmith to put one on. That adds cost or limits selection. Seeing the costs of barrels, it would almost be worthwhile just to get another shotgun in a different configuration than to swap barrels out. Unless I go used, that's a whole other adventure though.

I talked with my local gunsmith and a modification he's done to quite a few 18" barrels is to put a choke in. That's exactly what I was wanting to do and this would pretty much eliminate any desire to exchange barrels. With this in mind, I'd probably just stick with an improved cylinder choke for general use and pop in a modified if I wanted to hunt small game with humane kills at longer distances. Don't chokes mean more than barrel length for distance and patterning? I also called Mossberg on modifying a barrel for choke and they said that the warranty for the barrel is void but the receiver and everything else is still under warranty. Being my first new gun and that the 500/590 has a 10-year warranty, that's important to me.


LAZY EYED SNIPER said:
Looks to me like you need an 835.

Threaded for chokes, chambered for up to 3.5" magnum loads, and compatible with just about any accessory made for the 500 or 590. They're over bored to 10 gauge diameter so not recommended for use with slugs, but can be swapped out for a rifled 835 barrel for sabots or a smooth bore 590a1 barrel for rifled slugs. The 835 comes in barrel lengths from 20"*28" and most are camo finished, but there are a few models that are blued or park'd. Don't think there anre any 835 models with ghost rings, but there are models with 3-dot rifle sights.

Seems the 835 might suit your needs without any modification...
Click to expand...
I did look at the 835 but not being able to run slugs through it kind of killed the idea for me. Like you said, I could purchase another barrel but then I pretty much have a 590 that's capable of 3.5" shells which is more ass-kickery than I want/need now. The issue is, I have enough funds set aside for a decent shotgun, couple hundred rounds and a sling or accessories. I don't have enough set aside for a second barrel and I'd like something that does buckshot, birdshot and slugs out of the box.


John A. said:
The biggest differences in the 590 and the 500 is as follows.

The 590 has a little thicker barrel
The 590 doesn't have any plastic parts in the trigger assembly.

Those are the main ones that I always come back to, although there are a few more.

There is really nothing wrong with the 590, the 500, and I'm even going to throw in another you hadn't mentioned. The Maverick 88. It is nearly the same as the 500 but a little less expensive. And you can get them with the higher capacity magazine you want right off the shelf.

example:
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=488557090#PIC

Though keep in mind that you can load a pump shotgun on the go so magazine capacity isn't a major concern for most.

A shotgun is a very capable tool and able to take down anything that walks on the North American continent with the correct selection of shell(s).

Just one bit of advice, while a 357 will kill a bear, it's not likely to stop a charging bear.
Click to expand...

Do all 590's have the thicker barrel and metal safety & trigger? I thought only select models have those? Mossberg's site leaves a lot to be desired in terms of pictures and information.

I skipped over the Maverick 88 due to the safety being relocated. While it's probably a fine gun, I'd rather spend a bit more to get some premium features. I don't mind paying more for quality, within reason. It's also a similar reason why I chose against the 930 which was what I originally wanted. The 930 being a semi has the bolt on the side. What happens in a defense situation when the round you chambered doesn't fire for some reason? You have to move one of your hands off it's position to cycle the bolt. With the 500/590, you press the release with your middle finger and jack a new round in, all while keeping your hands in the proper location, ready to fire.




With all of this in mind, I don't see any negatives in going with a 590 20" 9-shot for my needs. The 50669 seems pretty damn good.
50669-media.jpg

Already has the MAGPUL forend that I was looking to install on whatever shotgun I decided on. Having the adjustable MAGPUL stock is nice too. It seemed like at the gun store there weren't any that really fit me nicely. The LOP was either too long or too short. Having the peace of mind of an adjustable one that's not a pistol grip (hated the way those felt) is great. It seems like a stout defense weapon and with a choke could be a decent SHTF hunting gun.

Any ideas/comments on my thought process here? Thanks again guys.
 
You may want to look into this for your 590a1...

https://www.vangcomp.com/

In short:
  • Higher Rate of Accuracy- 12-inch shot patterns @ 25 yds. with standard 00 Buck, 2-times tighter than a cylinder bore barrel.
  • Less Felt Recoil- Faster follow-up shots, easier training, makes 12ga accessible to all shooters.
  • Maximize performance- No need for choke tubes and their maintenance/ limitations.
  • The porting system decreases muzzle rise by up to 90%. It decreases muzzle flash by up to 50%. It is a sound investment.
 
Spanky, I have an older model 590 Mariner (1989) with 20" and 8+1. Pretty sure you'll like the model. One of the nice things about it is that the elevator is in the Up position with the bolt closed, so reloading won't trap your thumb. I did an easy mod on the loading port on mine to make it even easier to reload. Beveled the edges to open it up some and get rid of the sharpies. There's a post about how to do this somewhere on the forum. Pretty simple to do.

Other than that my Mariner is factory stock.

Ammo wise I've fired birdshot, #4 and 00 buck, and Brenneke slugs thru it with no problems of any kind. It is a cyl. bore, no choke, so pellet patterns do spread fairly early, but there is ammo available that will reduce that. Shotcup designs. Note that, depending on the ammo, you may only be able to stuff 7 2 3/4" shells in the mag tube. That's not unique to Mossbergs tho. :)

m590full.jpg~original
 
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It sounds like you have done your homework and found what fits your specs. And it comes with the foreend you desire--having to buy it aftermarket will only increase cost. If your LGS has one, it would be advantageous to handle it before purchase to make sure it is the "one"... :)
 
Hi and welcome to MO!

Sounds like the 590 Magpul is the way to go, I've shot birds and varmints with the 20" cylinder bore and having the barrel threaded will open up more possibilities for you! You mentioned modified or improved but a full choke can work nicely with buckshot and I think federal makes a 3" magnum #1 buck with FliteControl that could work well with a non ported choke or even in the smooth bore. My experience with FliteControl is that it makes the round work as if being fired through a choked barrel.
A little experimenting may reveal the choke as unnecessary.
 
SHOOTER13 said:
I own the 20" 9-shot M590a1...it's a combat proven shotgun.
Click to expand...
I see you're a fan of the ghost rings. How do you like the feel of the 20" M590A1? Pretty balanced and easy to swing in close quarters?

SHOOTER13 said:
You may want to look into this for your 590a1...

https://www.vangcomp.com/

In short:
  • Higher Rate of Accuracy- 12-inch shot patterns @ 25 yds. with standard 00 Buck, 2-times tighter than a cylinder bore barrel.
  • Less Felt Recoil- Faster follow-up shots, easier training, makes 12ga accessible to all shooters.
  • Maximize performance- No need for choke tubes and their maintenance/ limitations.
  • The porting system decreases muzzle rise by up to 90%. It decreases muzzle flash by up to 50%. It is a sound investment.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the link, it seems pretty interesting. I'll keep it in mind for down the road. I would like to put a few hundred rounds through the gun before doing any hard mods that may void the warranty.


GunnyGene said:
Spanky, I have an older model 590 Mariner (1989) with 20" and 8+1. Pretty sure you'll like the model. One of the nice things about it is that the elevator is in the Up position with the bolt closed, so reloading won't trap your thumb. I did an easy mod on the loading port on mine to make it even easier to reload. Beveled the edges to open it up some and get rid of the sharpies. There's a post about how to do this somewhere on the forum. Pretty simple to do.

Other than that my Mariner is factory stock.

Ammo wise I've fired birdshot, #4 and 00 buck, and Brenneke slugs thru it with no problems of any kind. It is a cyl. bore, no choke, so pellet patterns do spread fairly early, but there is ammo available that will reduce that. Shotcup designs. Note that, depending on the ammo, you may only be able to stuff 7 2 3/4" shells in the mag tube. That's not unique to Mossbergs tho. :)

m590full.jpg~original
Click to expand...
That's a sweet gun right there. Is that the older version of the MarineCote? In that pic, it almost looks like a chromed out beast. I'll have to find that thread you're talking about to smooth things up. I don't mind doing some dremel work after the gun is broke in if it helps smooth things up.


Bobster said:
It sounds like you have done your homework and found what fits your specs. And it comes with the foreend you desire--having to buy it aftermarket will only increase cost. If your LGS has one, it would be advantageous to handle it before purchase to make sure it is the "one"... :)
Click to expand...
That's my thoughts exactly. I was looking at a plain jane 500 but adding up the cost of the ghost ring sights and MAGPUL forend, I'd end up paying more than I would just buying the 50669 MAGPUL 590 in the first place. Not to mention, I'd have to pay more to have my local gunsmith solder the sight on the barrel. Unfortunately, my local gun store didn't have anything MAGPUL in stock. There's another store I might try when it comes closer to purchasing. I'll probably end up buying online since my local gunsmith has an FFL, he's going to be the one modifying it anyway.

Rossignol said:
Hi and welcome to MO!

Sounds like the 590 Magpul is the way to go, I've shot birds and varmints with the 20" cylinder bore and having the barrel threaded will open up more possibilities for you! You mentioned modified or improved but a full choke can work nicely with buckshot and I think federal makes a 3" magnum #1 buck with FliteControl that could work well with a non ported choke or even in the smooth bore. My experience with FliteControl is that it makes the round work as if being fired through a choked barrel.
A little experimenting may reveal the choke as unnecessary.
Click to expand...
Yea, that's something I'm thinking about too. I'm going to have to get my hands on a wide variety of ammo and see what works. I've never messed with the flitecontrol rounds. My experience is mostly with the cheapest birdshot and occasional Remington buckshot run through a 18.5" sawn-off 500. I have a lot of hands-on experience left to learn. I just know enough that I love the look, feel and function of a 500/590 :D
 
Spanky, yes. It's the one you often see advertised as the "stainless steel" 590, that somebody is trying to sell for $800 or so. Unfortunately Mossberg never made a SS version, and discontinued the shiny Marinecote due to complaints that it glared too much. I think '89 was the last year for shiny Marinecote in fact. There was a slightly dulled version for a few years, then they went with what you see now. In any case, this model and the previous couple years are still coveted by many people (including a couple folks here ;) ). I bought this one ( used ) a few years ago at my local shop for $350. :)

Here's the thread I mentioned about the loading port mod: http://www.mossbergowners.com/forum...en-the-loading-port-how-far-did-you-go.13068/
 
I've posted these before but I think they deserve another look! :D
 

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Jean-Claude Van Damme is a Belgian martial artist ( kickboxer ) and actor Gunny..."The Muscles from Brussels"...and the 1993 movie was entitled "Hard Target".
 
Spanky said:
I see you're a fan of the ghost rings.

How do you like the feel of the 20" M590A1? Pretty balanced and easy to swing in close quarters?....

Thanks for the link, it seems pretty interesting. I'll keep it in mind for down the road. I would like to put a few hundred rounds through the gun before doing any hard mods that may void the warranty.
Click to expand...

YES, GOOD BALANCE & VERY ACCURATE with the ghost rings...(haven't had to swing in close quarters )

Understood...I would do the same thing...and if needed, go with Vang Comp. So far, it hasn't been necessary for me...but I wanted you to see the option.

 
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