• Mossberg Owners is in the process of upgrading the software. Please bear with us while we transition to the new look and new upgraded software.

Federal Shorty Rifled Slugs - loose slug?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Racer88

Racer88

.410
Hello! I just got my shipment of the previously vaporware Federal Shorty Rifled Slugs... for my Shockwave! Woohoo!

Shorty Slugs.jpg

One of the boxes sprung open in the shipment, spilling the shells into the main shipping box. No biggie. But as I was replacing the shells back into the box, I noticed that with some of the shells, if I shake them, the slug moves. Some more than others. Some a fair bit!

I opened a couple of the other boxes, and tested those shells.... little to no movement of the slug.

Is this "within normal limits" for a slug to have some play within the shell? Or are they dangerous to fire?

Thanks!
 
I don't see any reason why that would be a problem. The only time I've disposed shotshells is when they sat loose, rolling around the top tray of my ammo box so long that powder was starting to make it's way out through the crimp. Even then it probably would have been fine. And, if memory serves I've had a few slugs a little loose in the hull before too. I really don't think it's something to worry about. If it was me I'd use them, but it's up to you.
 
You WERE going to run some to see how they functioned, correct? :) If it were me I would use the "loose" ones to test. Load one and fire and see if all goes well--I think it will. Then do a mag dump and see how it goes. Or not... With the scarcity of shorty slugs, maybe one is enough? ;)

The same happened to me a few years ago with a couple cases of Russian "close out" birdshot, buck and slug shorties. Rather than repost all the pics etc. (if I can even find them ;) ) that I posted when I got them, I will link to a post that I could find. *** for some reason it is not letting me create a LINK so the url/html follows*** https://mossbergowners.com/forum/index.php?threads/aquila-mini-shells.20710/#post-294528
I thought I had done a more thorough write-up on those but couldn't find the post...

Anyhow, a number of the Russian slugs had come loose in the box, like your shipment. As none were lost from the package, I put them back in the couple boxes/25 that had let them escape, alternating orientation as from the factory, put a little tape to make the boxes secure, then put them into inventory. I didn't think or even check that the slugs may have come loose but I didn't notice anything out of wack or damage from floating around in the box. (I'm sitting here envisioning you shaking EVERY shell to see if it is loose! :D )

Anyanyhow, I'm fairly certain I did a mag dump out of the 500 (w/Opsol) at the range and didn't have any issues. That having NOT checked to see if the slugs were loose in the shell. I suppose I would have noticed if the shell was internally rattling like you did, but I didn't (notice). I do NOT think they will post ANY kind of issue but I'm not 100%, either. ;) Think of the dynamics as you pull the trigger: primer ignites the powder, powder expands as it burns pressurizing the contents of the shell expanding the hull so it seals in the chamber and pushing the slug and cup behind it towards the point of least resistance which is the muzzle. By that time, I think the cup will have stabilized the slug and the slug will NOT have skewed in the bore. Unless they slipped a 16 or 20ga in there by mistake... :D

My shells came from St. Pete, btw (FL not RU ;) ). I'm in the Daytona area. I think somebody had posted a "deals" link and I bought probably 500 of the various flavors (shot, buck and slug). They came to me in within days.
 
Bobster said:
Anyhow, a number of the Russian slugs had come loose in the box, like your shipment. As none were lost from the package, I put them back in the couple boxes/25 that had let them escape, alternating orientation as from the factory, put a little tape to make the boxes secure, then put them into inventory.
Click to expand...
Yep... exactly what I did. Two boxes popped open. Interestingly, those are the shells with loose slugs. The boxes that did not pop open... I checked a couple of them... slugs are tighter... no real movement.

Bobster said:
(I'm sitting here envisioning you shaking EVERY shell to see if it is loose! :D )
Click to expand...
I discovered the first one by accident, just by picking up a shell and putting it back into the taped-up box I noticed the "rattle" of the slug. Then I started intentionally shaking the others. And sure enough several were loose... to varying degrees.
Bobster said:
Think of the dynamics as you pull the trigger: primer ignites the powder, powder expands as it burns pressurizing the contents of the shell expanding the hull so it seals in the chamber and pushing the slug and cup behind it towards the point of least resistance which is the muzzle. By that time, I think the cup will have stabilized the slug and the slug will NOT have skewed in the bore.
Click to expand...

Yep, that occurred to me, as well. But I thought I would run it by the "collective" here. I figured someone would know about it or have experienced it.
 
Last edited:
Autonomous said:
How do you know it's loose?
Let me guess, because it is free to move?
It depends on what the meaning of is 'is'?
If the slug has moved rearward at the time of ignition the effect is the same.
Click to expand...
I don't think you're understanding. I didn't say it moved back and stayed put there. I'm saying it's movING. If I shake the shell back and forth, the slug rattles back and forth. It's loose. It's NOTHING like a rifle or pistol cartridge with a bullet that is pushed into the case. Rather the slug will slide all the way forward (to the crimp) and if I tilt the shell or shake it, it will move back / away from the crimp. I can SEE (and feel) it moving.
 
Autonomous said:
Are you understanding?
If the slug has moved rearward at the time of ignition the effect is the same.
Click to expand...
I disagree with your assessment in that regard. This is not the same as this:
1684370680980.png
In ^^^this^^^ situation, the bullet is fixed in the set-back position. It's not loose. It's not freely moving back and forth.
 
I have since done a google search and have come across similar threads about this on other forums. While I couldn't find a ton of info, it's apparently not that uncommon. And it seems it is not a problem.
 
Suggest you take your issue to a reloading forum where people understand how reduced case volume affects pressure.
Be sure to not listen and be pedantic there as well. They like that.
 
Last edited:
Now I’m even more confused if that’s possible. Being pedant is to be excessively concerned with minor details while then being intimated that catastrophic results will ensue should the rounds in question not be more thoroughly investigated?…..derp
 
Rodburner said:
Now I’m even more confused if that’s possible. Being pedant is to be excessively concerned with minor details while then being intimated that catastrophic results will ensue should the rounds in question not be more thoroughly investigated?…..derp
Click to expand...
I was hoping to hear from someone who has experience with what I have described.
 
Sorry 88. I don’t have any insight into loose slugs, but many of my buckshot shells rattle a little, regardless of brand. Personally I don’t give it a second thought as the shells are made of plastic and basically unfurl when fired, unlike rigid fixed cases used in rifle and pistol ammo. Can’t imagine salt or birdshot is compacted, so….
 
@Autonomous

What you don't understand is that the wad base is pretty much held in place by very tight friction. Unless the wad gets shoved back, which is highly unlikely, there will not be a pressure spike. During loading, as the hull wall transitions toward the metal base and wad seating depth is set the walls get thicker. Between the powder charge and the wad unable to move more deeply toward the primer, it is extremely unlikely (rare) that there could be a pressure spike.

I'd bet that some of the roll crimps at the shell mouth aren't quite in spec, allowing slight movement of the slug. But look at a shotgun hull cut in half lengthwise. You will see what I am talking about.

I would think a shotgun shell would have obvious deformation to the plastic if there was a setback situation

Now calm down.

nitesite
 
Again, I did not say the shotshells had setback. I used the example to make a point. "Projectile setback can spike pressures. Beware."
I wanted to make the point It could be a safety issue, not get drawn into what the meaning of is 'is.'

Not being snarky so don't make something out of the following.

Do you have specific knowledge of factors that affect shotgun shell pressures? Do you know for sure the wad will control pressure when the slug is free to move? It makes a heck of a difference with metallic cartridges.
Do we have any expert shot shell reloaders here that can weigh in?

I get it, I was a little salty. Frankly, I care more about making someone aware of a potentially dangerous situation than being called a fool by a mod in a 'conversation' or someone's feelings.
This situation makes me question if the priority here is safety or feelings. Do with that what you will.
 
Autonomous said:
This situation makes me question if the priority here is safety or feelings.
Click to expand...

I think the forum format attracts more "seasoned" users who have made it this far by being "safe". So when their safety discipline is questioned, their "feelz" might get a little hurt. :)

But of course there are "new" shooters both young and old, and we can't have any of them dying off on us through unsafe shooting practices, so there IS that... ;)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top