Somebody help me decide
- Thread starter FMA1972
- Start date
Simple question, not so simple answer. Lot of factors to consider. Your house construction, and proximity of neighbors, etc. (over penetration issue for buckshot and slugs). Generally speaking you need something that will penetrate thru perhaps several layers of heavy clothing and deep enough to cause serious to lethal damage. Most advice you'll hear is 00 buckshot, or at a minimum #4 buckshot.
Effectiveness also depends on the individual bad guy. He might be a 98lb weakling or he may be 300lbs of muscle wearing a level IIIA vest. You never know.
I have 00buck and Brenneke slugs loaded alternately in mine, just in case it's the later gorilla with a vest.
But I don't have any neighbors for nearly a half mile in any direction thru dense woods, and I sleep with the only other occupant of the house.
PS: To answer your last question "If that's not enough, then what?" You die.
Effectiveness also depends on the individual bad guy. He might be a 98lb weakling or he may be 300lbs of muscle wearing a level IIIA vest. You never know.
I have 00buck and Brenneke slugs loaded alternately in mine, just in case it's the later gorilla with a vest.
But I don't have any neighbors for nearly a half mile in any direction thru dense woods, and I sleep with the only other occupant of the house.PS: To answer your last question "If that's not enough, then what?" You die.
^^^^^yup what gunny said plus all this,,,,
viewtopic.php?f=38&t=7074
viewtopic.php?f=38&t=7074
I would not go with #8.. It really depends on a lot of things. Are you in an apt., single fam. home, any kids in the house, how far from your neighbors ? It will pay you to research this as every thing really matters. What will work for others may not be the best for you. As for me I live alone, neighbor is pretty close, but if I need to shoot it will be down the hall (35 ft. to the front door) and parallel to any homes near me, nothing across the street, so I will use the Federal L.E 00 buck w/ 8 pellets. I have a 930 SPX and in the side saddle I have some Centurion slugs I can load real fast if needed. I hope this helps plus there will be many people chiming in that know more than I do. Also you may want to walk thru your house at night and get a feel of it when dark. Make sure you can get to flashlights placed where you may need extra light. And PRACTICE PRACTICE PRACTICE. Wow I am a slow typer.
cbshooter said:
I would not recommend doing a room clearing tour, unless you have family in immediate danger. A monitored alarm system that gets the police out of the donut shop should be able to be activated on break in, or with a key chain remote. Until the leo show up, I'd advise taking cover in the bedroom, behind a dresser or something else, gun at the ready. If the bad guy comes in you'll be in much better position to take him out, physically and legally. Stand up shoot outs are for the movies and idiots (no offense intended, but if you don't have to - don't).
As for lighting, you can get remote controlled or motion detecting lighting and place it strategically in the house and aimed at the likely route an intruder would take (that is aimed away from you and positioned to degrade his night vision without giving away your position). For example aimed down a hallway or staircase.
FMA1972 said:
#8 Bird will certainly give someone a real bad day, but relying on it to stop an intruder hell bent on hurting your family would be a bad idea. There's a plethora of data and YouTube videos on the penetration characteristics of Bird shot... usually only a few inches into a gel test media. Now factor in heavy clothing, muscles (or manboobs?) and a breastplate... then some more body cavity... getting the drift?
It just doesn't compare to Buckshot in stopping power. Most will recommend, as said above, that #4 Buck is your minimum... with 00 being the top choice (which is what I keep in the 590). If you're in an urban area or Apt... stay away from slugs, as these will certainly go through ALOT of material before stopping.
Look up the Box O' Truth and you'll find extensive testing of different loads, handgun and rifle rounds through usual building materials such as drywall and 2x4's. Best advice I can give is be aware of your surroundings, know where you're family is and always, always aim your shot at your intended target, the bad guy.
aksavanaman said:
manboobs?
I'd definitely stay away from target loads or bird shot. They just don't have the density to transfer enough energy into the target. I put 100 rounds of various BB, #2, and #8 shot, into bowling pins yesterday and none of the shot even penetrated the thin outer plastic cover of the pins. To each their own, but I don't see a reason to take a chance with target shot when there are so many options in 00 or even #4 buck that WILL get the job done...
Gunny, I respect your thoughts but, I did not say do a room clearing drill all I said was get used to what your house looks like in the dark, things could escalate more quickly than anticipated. And like I have SEEN "when seconds count the police are minutes away". OP as Gunny implied do everything you can to harden your defenses as the harder you make it for the bad guy to get in the better your chances are. FWIW, my daughter does not like guns so, I had her take her car alarm fob to bed with her and low and behold it scared off a guy that was trying to gain access to their garage. All I am saying is keep an open mind to all suggestions that you get. Good luck
LAZY EYED SNIPER said:aksavanaman said:
manboobs?
I would say they mimic IWBA standards
GunnyGene, I totally agree with your senario to take position in the far corner of a room (bedroom in my case) if an intruder breaks in. I do have a top line alarm system, including glass break, and we as a family have drilled for a break-in. I doubt an intruder would come up the stairs if the alarm is activated, but if they do, I will be ready and waiting. The only thing I may do is the light thing you suggested, aimed at the bedroom door activated by opening. As for ammo type...you all have steered me away from #8 birdshot and towards 00 Buck. Thanks for the replies everyone! This forum is much more friendly and helpful than Smith & Wesson's.
FMA1972 said:
There's tons of lighting options out there. Battery operated led lights, sensors for motion, body heat (infrared), sound, etc. Even walmart sells them. Pays to shop around for this kind of thing, but be careful of the cheapies.
Glad to hear you have a alarm system. Many people don't. One other thing you might consider, if you have a long driveway as I do, is a metal sensing driveway alarm. Gives you some extra time before the door gets kicked in.
Went out and shot #8 birdshot this afternoon, then shot 25 rounds of Law Enforcement "reduced recoil" 00 buck. It had about the same recoil effect as the #8. However, it says on the box "reduced penetration". So.....should I use the LE reduced recoil 8 pellet 00 buck, or just go with the standard 9 pellet 00 buckshot? The reason I am being so specific is, I want to practice with the same ammo I will need in the event of you know.
FMA1972 said:
Mossy has a good point. I don't know how familiar you are with shotgun ammo, but one thing to think about is the pattern/spread of the ammo at various distances. It's not the number of pellets that leave the muzzle that counts, it's the number that hit the target. This will lead us into a discussion of chokes (which you don't have on your 590 - it's a cylinder bore) and how different shell designs from different mfg. perform. Some, like the RIO 00 buck cast a very wide pattern for a variety of technical reasons. Others, such as the Federal Flight Control, will maintain a very tight pattern for a much greater distance due to the shot cup that contains the pellets, thus more pellets on target assuming you've got a good aim. If you're not real accurate, Rio might be the better choice. Some mfg's will use a 'filler material', or harder lead alloy, both of which will reduce the pattern spread, primarily because of aerodynamic reasons. Soft lead pellets get deformed a bit under acceleration, which impairs their performance as they leave the muzzle. Think about a bowling ball with a flat spot.
There's many tradeoffs to consider, not the least of which is cost. Rio is cheap, the Federal is expensive.
So it's more than just 00buck vs. something else. It's 00 buck option 1 vs 00buck options 2,3,4,......... Ditto other pellet sizes. Sometimes I think a supercomputer would be a great help in this decision. Or flipping a quarter.